Strong Opinions on Payroll Tax
Strong Opinions on Payroll Tax Save Email Print
Posted: 5:39 AM Nov 6, 2007
 Last Updated: 5:51 AM Nov 6, 2007
 Reporter: Michael Wooten
Email Address: michael.wooten@wsaz.com
108 comments
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Democracy in action. People packed into a middle school gymnasium in Grayson, Kentucky, Monday night to speak out against a new tax.

The mayor and most of council support it, but almost everybody else there strongly disagreed.

It was certainly a heated meeting at East Carter Middle school.

It was a chance for the public to weigh in on a proposed payroll tax.

About 500 people showed up to speak out. But before folks took to the microphones, city council voted to amend the ordinance, dropping the rate from 1.75 percent to 1.5 percent.

Although some people thought that was no big deal, after it was lowered, there was thundering applause. But from there, there was little agreement between the speakers and the mayor and council.

Mayor George Steele says the payroll tax is necessary to the future of Grayson. But the vast majority of folks say that's nonsense. Most of them live outside the city limits, but work in Grayson. And they say it's unfair to make them pay this tax.

One person asked Mayor Steele, "Why is it that I don't have a vote? I'm asking you why I don't have a vote in how my money is spent in this town. You've made up your mind or you would be willing to let us get together and discuss this."

The mayor said, "I understand how they feel, but I still want better for this community than what we've got, and we're not going to get there unless we put some effort into it. This type of tax is nothing new. About 130 towns in kentucky alone already pay it, including Ashland, Pikeville and Paintsville and many other towns."

This fight isn't over. There will be one more reading of this ordinance next Tuesday.

Folks are expected to come out to that meeting and have their voices heard.

This tax will likely take effect January 1.

As of now, only one council member is against it.
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Posted by: tayee on Nov 26, 2007 at 09:53 AM
how come the two new city clerk office workers in making the same $8.00 a hour that the police does? its it because both new workers are kin to the mayor?
Posted by: taxee on Nov 24, 2007 at 11:02 PM
TO B.R.D.-I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW MUCH THE GRAYSON POLICE OFFICERS MAKE,I'VE HEARD DIFFERENT AMOUNTS,ALTHOUGH I'M SURE THEY KNEW HOW MUCH THEY WERE GOING TO GET PAID BEFORE THEY TOOK THE JOB.AND FOR A FACT THEY WERE HIRED,NOT DRAFTED,THEY TOOK THESE JOBS WITH THER'RE EYES OPEN.MAYBE IT WAS THE NICE FAMILY PLAN THAT GOES ALONG WITH IT,I DON'T KNOW.BUT THEY DID KNOW HOW MUCH THEY WERE GOING TO GET PAID.YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A TOWN THAT HAS A LOW INCOME LEVEL,THE CITY POLICE ARE PROBABLY SOME OF THE BEST PAID PEOPLE IN GRAYSON WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE WHOLE PICTURE,MOST OF GRAYSON'S WORK FORCE DOSEN'T HAVE NEARLY AS MUCH.THE THING IS IT ONLY TAKES SOMETHING LIKE .16 % PAYROLL TAX TO START THEIR RETIREMENT.BUT LIKE THE REST OF US THE POLICE OFFICERS TOOK JOBS CLOSE TO HOME MAKING WHAT THEY COULD.WE ALL HAVE THE OPTION OF GOING SOMEWHERE ELSE TO MAKE MORE MONEY,IT'S JUST THAT THE REST OF US AREN'T ASKING THE POLICE OFFICERS TO TAKE A HUNK OUT OF THEIR INCOME TO FORTIFY OURS.WOULD THEY LIKE IT?
Posted by: B.R.D on Nov 24, 2007 at 03:47 PM
First off yes the city officers get paid if that is what you want to call it,the grayson officers do answer all there calls and will continue to do so but they didnt take the jobs for most of the public to bad mouth about them i feel that are city has about the best city officers and they do a great job i know myself i have drove threw grayson and seen grayson city officers helping people that there cars have broken down the officers take them to part store,gas station what ever it takes to get the car running and do you think it is the city officers job to do that i think not they do that because they are all good officers any way these officers can help there city they do,and nobody was bashing the grayson officers until the city taxe myself i think the city taxe is a great thing 1% come on now the thing is everbody is bad mouthing the city officers like they dont have to pay the city taxe but guess what they will have to pay that 1% just the same way as i do and you do
Posted by: taxee on Nov 21, 2007 at 11:34 PM
for B.R.D.-THE TAX DOSEN'T HELP ALL THE CITY EMPLOYEES,AS FOR SIDEWALKS,THE CITY OF GRAYSON WILL NOT CHANGE,THEY WILL FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO WASTE THE MONEY ON,SOMETHING MUCH MORE IMPORTANT THAN ROADS OR WALKS(THE STATE DOES MOST OF THIS ANYWAY)BESIDES,I HEAR WE HAVE A DIRE NEED OF AN M-16,DID YOU KNOW WE DIDN'T EVEN HAVE ONE M-16?MAYBE WE NEED AN ASSAULT VEHICLE TOO! HOWEVER,YES THE GRAYSON OFFICERS WILL CONTINUE TO ANSWER CALLS,THIS IS THE JOB THEY WERE HIRED FOR,AND LIKE ANYONE WHO SEEKS A JOB AND IS HIRED FOR THIS JOB,PERFORMANCE OF THESE DUTIES WOULD BE EXPECTED.AFTER ALL,THEY ARE GETTING PAID (AREN'T THEY?)
Posted by: james on Nov 19, 2007 at 02:34 PM
why could they not do some kind of fee. say 10.00 for each person living in the city or for each piece of propery owned. that would bring in a lot of money to . this would be a good way to bring in some money to .
Posted by: B.R.D on Nov 19, 2007 at 07:49 AM
ok people i have listen to just about everbody on here and on the streets bad mouth the grayson city police do you think that the police officers are the only ones that the 1%tax is going for well its not you have all the other city workers and over half of the sidewalks in the city needs repaired but the only ones that are getting bad mouthed are the police officers and they are still out on the streets protecting the city and you i can hear it now i dont live it the city well who you going to call when you are in the city of grayson and you have a car wreck or someone breaks in your car or starts a fight with you you are going to call grayson police dept and they are going to come and protect you even know that you have been bad mouthing them they are still going to do what they are trained to do serve and protect
Posted by: ashamed of grayson on Nov 16, 2007 at 09:17 AM
people in carter county need to think about a artical that was in the grayson journal times a few weeks back about what the police officers wages they said they are eligible for food stamps they make so little and that they only get 8 dollars a hour well thats more than they r worth and dont fire back at me what we do with out them better for a fact i live in a bad neighborhood not by choose it was not like that when we built and moved here and u cant just up and sell people knows the neighbor hood and wont buy in it we have police that know what goes on there is drugs bootleggers and stealing and all u hear is well obtain a warrant and we will do something what is there job and if they are eligible for food stamps go get them i sure they will come in handy why r tax dollars r buying the police officers there gas money to take them back and fourth to work and all there stops in between we have to buy r gas to go to work so by the time u figure free gas you saved that much a week u ok
Posted by: TAXEE on Nov 16, 2007 at 08:00 AM
I NOTICED THE COMMENT THAT HINTED AT THE MERCHANTS THAT BACKED THE TAX DIDN'T STAY AROUND LONG,DON'T WORRY,SOME OF US HAVE TAKEN UP THE TORCH!!THE WORD WILL GET OUT!!THER ACTUALLY WAS ONE MORE THAT DIDN'T GET HIS MENTION,THAT WILL BE FIXED ALSO. SO PAY ATTENTION,THE INFORMATION WILL REACH YOU SOON!!!SOME PEOPLE WILL SAY WHAT THE HECK,IT'S OVER,IT IS NOT OVER YET!!AND EACH TIME THEY MENTION TAKING THIS TAX FROM YOUR HARD EARNED CHECK,REMEMBER THIS COUNCIL---AND---REMEMBER THESE MERCHANTS!IF YOUR FAMILY HAS TO DO WITHOUT---REMEMBER THIS COUNCIL---REMEMBER THESE MERCHANTS!!
Posted by: ck on Nov 15, 2007 at 07:44 AM
I think this tax is wrong for this city. There are other ways to get money for the city, such as grants and etc. They should of searched for other ways before they voted this tax in. Why didn't they put together a committee made up from the people of the city to check on this. When the city council comes up for re-election I will say they all will be voted out but the one that didn't go for it. This tax is not going to make our police dept any better.
Posted by: Mary on Nov 14, 2007 at 05:21 PM
You know that was uncalled for. We are opposing. Why are we getting on here and acting like someone we aren't. This is getting out of hand they passed the tax at 1%. There is no more no one can do. Stop the rude comments!
Posted by: Bob Griffey on Nov 14, 2007 at 03:12 PM
Who is the real Travis Steele, and is he a police officer or an IT professional? I don't think it really matters. Whether you're for the 'real' Travis Steele or the satirical Travis Steele, they both make good points. Keeping Farmers clear is of the utmost importance, you never know what kind of trouble our completely lawless youth might cause. What STS failed to mention is the fact that they also keep the City Building protected. They also do their jobs better with their top of the line cellphone communications system (CCS for short). RTS's good point is that he is keeping us all safe. He's a good ol' boy. By monitoring this board for fake identities, he's making sure that we'll be able to patron this forum without identity thieving heretic scum.
Posted by: KVD03 on Nov 14, 2007 at 01:05 PM
Well you fine people stuck together and got this tax lowerd too 1 percent. With committees being formed to find more ways to finance this city.(ANNEXATION) NOW lets everyone quit this bicering back and forth and set our sights to the future. Remember to make everyone accountable for the job their getting paid or not paid to do.
Posted by: Travis Steele on Nov 13, 2007 at 11:37 PM
This is for “Travis Steele”: This is the REAL Travis Steele. If YOU were the real Travis Steele, you would know how to spell, use correct grammar and capitaliztion, and you wouldn’t be wasting your time on this site trying to convince people you are someone else. You would also know that I don’t spend my time “clearing” Farmer’s. If you were the real Travis Steele you would know that what you just did is a crime. You would also know that there are ways to obtain IP addresses for people leaving fake identities on a public message board. Sleep well while my colleagues and I are out making sure everyone (even you) are safe.
Posted by: Travis Steele on Nov 13, 2007 at 09:07 PM
i have to say something becaus this has been on my brain for too long. i dont think that all this arguing makes any sense it would be different if i werent doin my job but i do do my job and i think i do it very well!!!!! i dont even own a cellphone because im payed so little and my family requires a lot of money. i dont think that a drug test is fair because thats just going to be more money wasted. we have suvs that we cant drive because we dont have enough money for gas to operat them. we keep farmers clear! isnt that enough? if you can think of something more we could do, tell us! i think that this is a good idea nd hopefully i can do my job better by getting more money.
Posted by: Billy Yates on Nov 13, 2007 at 05:20 PM
Who shops in Grayson anyway? They don't even sell Tremor or Turkey brand pants!
Posted by: Lou Anne Platter on Nov 13, 2007 at 05:06 PM
I, too, am APPALLED AND SADDENED. I'm appalled that somebody who is elected Mayor (and/or councilperson) can levy a tax on people that do not live in his jurisdiction and therefore cannot vote for or against him. And I'm saddened that we have corrupt policemen who already make more money than I do, and who are going to take from my very meager paycheck to give them even more. One thing I am happy about, however, is the fact that the tri-state IS reading this and that (even though it's not going to do anything to rid us of this unfair and unwanted tax) at least some people are being called out for what they really are. I know that some of us have stepped on a lot of toes, but personally, it does me good to know that there are other people out there who think the same way I do. (Everybody has been too afraid to speak up for too long.) I plead for WSAZ to do some legitimate investigative journalism in Carter. I think the tri-state would be shocked. Thank you Pearl, for being brave.
Posted by: Amazed on Nov 13, 2007 at 10:30 AM
I am all for accountability on how the money collected is used, not the possible ways it could be used but how it will be used. I have lived here in Grayson for many years and have seen little change for the better. I realize that money is needed to improve the city but you need to find a fair way to generate that money. I do also agree that the excesses should seriously be looking into - Not just police vehicles being used off duty but also School buses. Drug testing should be mandatory for all city & County workers. And it should be done at a doctors office to prevent those who wish to hide their "habits" from bringing in a clean sample to replace their "tainted" one. I have read a few post's regarding police officers using drugs, This is a widespread problem that needs to be addressed, Recently a bus driver was fired due to drug use, Do we want drug users transporting our children? Or protecting our streets? Will this tax help solve these issues or over look them?
Posted by: KVD03 on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:00 AM
RebelYell, I don't think anyone has got that much BRASS. It would be very ugly and would shock this state. Probably would make NATIONAL news. The group is way to big and may extend all the way to Frankfort.
Posted by: Appalled, Cont. on Nov 13, 2007 at 12:33 AM
The appointment process was that they received applications for the position. The standing committee voted him into office not the mayor. So for those that have made those accusations, find out the facts about the process before going on-line. I pray that you stop the pollution on this web-site and write about the tax. Whether or not it passes, It is up to the leaders of the city. Now, Everyone does have the right to voice their opinion, but when you use your voice, use your brain first. It may be a hard time for all of us but as mom always said, This too shall pass. If you don't like what is going on in the city, then get out there and vote. It is your right....
Posted by: appalled and saddened on Nov 13, 2007 at 12:22 AM
To all of you that feel your comments must be read by the whole tri-state area, I am shocked at your audacity! I can not believe the allegations that have been made to everyone that reads this web site. You have totally misrepresented the facts and reason for this tax. Whether I am for it or against it, I can't believe how you have lied about good citizens of this county. I know George and Ada Steele personally. I can not believe how you have taken your anger about the tax out on these people. Of course, those of us that live in this community know the truth but people of the tri-state do not and the lies that are being told are (again) putting a black eye on our town (actually KY). When residents of KY are represented to the nation, we are the hillbilly rednecks that are uneducated and no wonder!!!! Now, about the Fraley family, you the city have elected Brandon to office. I don't believe for one minute that KCU has played any part in it. Cont.
Posted by: RebelYell on Nov 12, 2007 at 08:26 AM
I'm amazed at the comments I am reading. And some of you have more brass than the Mayor himself. I do plead with WSAZ that they investigate this town or find someone that will. For as KVDO3 mentioned that an officer said things could get alot tougher on those of us opposed to this tax, it's not far fetched. I, myself, have heard things that would make one feel they were in a movie instead of trying to do something good for the people of a community alone. When you have to worry about the possibility of being unfairly targeted by the police force in your town, there is a problem. When you wonder if you could have things planted on you to make the charges, you do worry. It shall not stop our voices from being heard, yet, I implore anyone with any connection to the "outside world" that doesn't fear the good old boy system as I've heard it called, to get someone in this town to investigate it. Before something happens to someone that has voiced their opinion a little too loudly.
Posted by: against the tax on Nov 12, 2007 at 06:07 AM
I just want to let everyone know the reason Mr. Fraley won the the election. It was the people at KCU. His family is connected down there and all the students were told to vote for him. Which I don't know why the students should get to vote in city elections, since they are only here temporarily and half of them probably won't have to pay this tax. Also, he got appointed because his mother and the mayors' wife are such good friends.
Posted by: thoughts on Nov 11, 2007 at 08:47 PM
Hey, everyone is upset with Brandon and George, but they were not the only ones for this tax. Yes, they are the ones doing the talking but lets not forget that Pam Nash, Terry Stamper and the others, not including Ms. Crum are in favor of this. I just wonder if there spouses will be paying. Also, don't feel to bad Brandon's mother works for the school system and she will be paying too.
Posted by: Still upset on Nov 11, 2007 at 05:13 PM
Thank you KVD03! You had a lot of good points. A lot of people thought the shaved ice stand was the new headquarters. And a lot of people were tricked into thinking they were watching over our schools, but come to find out, they are just taking their kids to school or picking them up? How many people have employers that let them use their vehicles and unending gas supply for that? What if they got a call? What if they were involved in a wreck? How would the city explain that to their insurance company? People keep saying the police need to do something with the drug problem. There have been comments that they don't want the big guys coming down on them or burning them out. Someone has to and when you take an oath to serve and protect, you have a responsibility to do it!!
Posted by: c on Nov 11, 2007 at 09:53 AM
Does people really realize the affect it could have on us? Everyone of us - even if you don't work in the city. I pay $95 weekly for babysitting - in order to help adjust the the taxes, don't you think that they won't raise their rate? What about the local's that own the restaraunts? They are talking about raising their employees pay to adjust. Don't you think that we all are going to have to pay? This is the reason for the boycott, in my opinion. Not really for punishing the City --to make the business owners realize that it will hurt everybody. I have not bought 1 thing this weekend and will not on Tuesday. Not only that, if the payroll tax passes, I will pull everything in town. Bucket drives (including the fire department) will no longer get even one penny from my pocket. This will negatively effect even project Merry Christmas and others with good causes. Let it be said from this day forward, It will only be a business relationship Grayson. INCLUDING no parks!
Posted by: no name on Nov 11, 2007 at 01:03 AM
This is in response to Ada Steele 1st. Get real. If you think we are stupid enough to believe your cousin just happened to get hired because she is so qualified then you need help. 2nd, this tax stinks all over from your family input, we are not dumb, we know your little boy is who this is all about. 3rd, you may not have been on the board of education but you sure did enough griping that they gave you your way most of the time. This tax is unfair. We should have a say in it and or a vote. It should be illegal to come in a just take someones hard earned money. I think police deserve a lot more pay for what they do, but you should not come in and take from us without a fair and I mean fair meeting about it. Just remember there's an old saying, don't spit up in the air it will come back down on you.
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 10, 2007 at 10:56 PM
cont. By law the uses for the tax have to be distinctly specified for it to be legal. So far the city's intentions for the revenue have been extremely vague. Listing general expenses won't cut it. That's a clear violation of the governing rules. It was said that this ordinance made no provisions for exemptions to anyone. Perhaps not directly, but does it honor previous exemptions allowed by other statutes/ordinances etc. ? Most do. If a business owner has created a corporation and pays themself a salary, then they will have to pay the tax on that salary. If their business is not set up that way, they are possibly exempt. The thing is that it is easy to change this status. Maybe that's why there was little input/representation/involvement by Grayson's business community. Is it possible that they could reap the benefits of this tax without contributing to it? There are so many unanswered questions. Let's get all the facts before we rush into a decision that we may all regret.
Posted by: Lou Anne Platter (cont.) on Nov 10, 2007 at 10:26 PM
And if you want to know why we aren't more vocal about corruption in the police department, it's this simple fact: I have kids in the high school and the middle school. They'll have their licenses soon enough. Do I want the cops harassing my son and my daughters? HECK NO. I know for a fact would happens if you speak out against the police. (Talking about Mr Jessie.) I'll bend over and pay the payroll tax before I turn my children into sitting ducks for the GPD. And they know this. It's just so frustrating. I have no vote, I get nothing in return for the tax, I barely make it as it is. Soon I'll have teenaged drivers and my insurance will go up, and gas & winter heating is going up. Why should I have to pay for these corrupt druggies to get a raise? Like I said, I had the upmost respect for Mr Steele, I really did. (Not his wife or son so much, but I honestly did think he was a good man.) I just feel betrayed now. I do want to thank Pearl, though, for her brave decision.
Posted by: Lou Anne Platter (cont.) on Nov 10, 2007 at 10:25 PM
Also I find it funny that nobody has ever answered any of the most basic questions on here. Such as, how does throwing money at a problem make the problem go away? How does giving the city employees a raise make them do their jobs better? How much money will this unfairest of taxes generate, and how will the money be spent? Will Travis get it all? Speaking of WonderCop, does Grayson's finest have to take random and unannounced drug tests? And is it any wonder Mr Fraley won the council race on Tuesday? Duh, people. Most of the people who are going to be paying this tax DO NOT LIVE IN THE CITY LIMITS AND COULD NOT VOTE. Sheesh. We all have heard horror stories about corruption in the police department, if you haven't heard about the drugs and "harassment" of young girls, ask around, you'll get an earful. Maybe WSAZ should do a story about THAT. Because we're afraid of the cops here, WSAZ, and that's the honest truth. Lord only knows what kind of dirt you'd uncover.
Posted by: Lou Anne Platter on Nov 10, 2007 at 10:24 PM
Well there is one day left and I have boycotted Grayson the past 2 days. I will continue to do so tomorrow. I do realize that some businesses are against this unfairest of taxes and I'll not boycott forever, just this weekend. (Except for McDonald's...next time I want a Big Mac it'll come from Summit because Sam Perry will never get another dime from me or my friends and family. I hope others on here did the same. I had to laugh about the comments about the shaved ice stand. SO TRUE. Also, I do respect the fire dept but as a kid some of our entertainment was watching the GFD drive to the station when a siren was heard. It's a wonder they never killed anybody, the way they drove! LOL Aw, those were the good old days, back when I had George and Ada as teachers, when I really respected them both. No, I couldn't vote in the city election (cuz I live outside city limits) but I was actually happy when Mr Steele won. DOH! Now I am sad and wish we could have Leda back.
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 10, 2007 at 09:54 PM
A common misconception about the payroll tax is that it is to be used in part for pay raises for city employees. The employees have already received their pay raise including retro pay. The payroll tax is earmarked for employee retirement not salary increases. RE: USING CITY VEHICLES ON PERSONAL TIME. If you can get a straight answer ask the mayor what the city's fuel bill is...then go ask Mooch what the county's fuel bill is. You might find the answer interesting. Not only does using city vehicles on personal time cost the city a fortune in fuel, there is also the added burden of tires, extra oil changes, increased mechanical fees, and the racking up of miles and hours on the vehicles which cause them to have be replace more often than necessary. A huge savings could be
Posted by: KVD03 cont. on Nov 10, 2007 at 11:22 AM
There's alot more that be said and I'm sure I'm leaving something out. I FEEL for those you can't aford this tax but it's coming no matter what. So let's hold them accountable for their actions. Attend the meetings speak up on expenditures. Ask questions, take pictures if you see someone asleep on the job or hanging out loafing istead of doing there job. MAKE everbody accountable even the volunteers. One last comment for those who remember when Grayson was better protected. I wounder if G.M. is avaible to bring back law and order to this fine city. I know he was hated for it but he done a fine job. It's a shame Buford Pusser is dead..
Posted by: KVD03 cont. on Nov 10, 2007 at 11:13 AM
I don't know what the pay scales are but with this in mind officers could be making 18 to 20 dollars an hr. Ofcourse when a threat was made to get a raise, GS should have said don't let the door hit you in the butt on the way out!! A libary, now who needs a libary? There is a libary funded partly by the state at KCU and the local schools that we are ALL allowed to use. So don't be fooled there. Yes, let's build a skateboard park or any park for that matter that can be vandolized and attract dope dealers for are youth. But now this won't happen because the PD is going straighten up and do a better job at protecting the city. Another thing here the FD also are getting money from the county for fire protection. Ins surcharge tax, remember. If you want to boycott certain businesses then that's your right but I don't totally agree with that move. McD's is going to pass on this tax by raising his prices and police officers are still going to go to Bob's after hrs.
Posted by: KVD03 cont. on Nov 10, 2007 at 10:53 AM
The PD has it's fair share of problems. (past and present) They need a leader that doesn't play favorites or has a GF working for them. If you live outside the city them you shuldn't drive city vech. home. Drive your own vech. to work. They don't need a detective, everybody should wear a structured uniform and patrol the city. Not be sitting at the shaved ice stand for hrs. on end. The AA highway isn't not in the city. A comment was made by one officer that things can get alot tuffer in the town for those against this tax. Well that maybe but that officer should take his flustration out on the thieves and dope dealers not the people who do 45mph down CM blvd. Dope arrest leads to confiscated property and cash that can be sold and used for the budget. Mayor GS needs to restructure the health ins. and have the workers pay for a portion of there ins. That's only fair too. Ins. can count for as much as $5.00 and hr. to an employees pay.
Posted by: KVD03 on Nov 10, 2007 at 10:39 AM
While I sit here and read these comments and agree with P.H. and Sheila. What has always LACKED with this city is PLANNING. That's why the water plant at the lake isn't theirs. Nobody in city goverment has ever been able to see 50yrs. down the road. Taxes and annexation shouldv'e been done in the 60's and 70's. With that said I'm not in favor of this pay-roll tax either since other options have not been done. Mayor GS says nobody wants to be annexed but this should be done anyway reguardless. Then let people vote on this issue after the fact. Cities can't grow without annexing. This new tax is coming and the poor people can't do anything about it. What needs to be done now is make city gov. and it's agencies be accountable for their job performance. The FD is volunteer and should remain as such. There will always be people (young or old) more than willing to have red lights in their cars. There should be a full time paid Chief and Dep. Cheif that are responsible for the dept. actions.
Posted by: (continued) on Nov 10, 2007 at 07:45 AM
I also know there's people that are willing to work, but not able. I'm not against them getting help. But I feel that anyone who asks for help , etc.... food stamps, welfare, should be required to endure a drug test. If we get more of the deadbeats off welfare and foodstamps and put them to work, imagine how much money we could add for this tax. Maybe this should be looked into, instead of taking the hard working taxpayers money. If not, before long people will find it easier to get on welfare then to work and earn money!
Posted by: barely getting by on Nov 10, 2007 at 07:35 AM
I am all for the Police and Fire Department of Grayson getting a raise, if they have earned it! Some of them probably have, while others have not. I am not willing to help pay their wages if all they do is sit by and let all the drug dealers and drug addicts have free rein of the City of Grayson. Why is it that all Grayson ever gets noticed for is a scandal or arguement? Never anything good, hmm wonder why? Could it be there's never anything good happens in our town. It didn't take the Mayor very long to find a way to take more money out of our pockets and put in someone else's. There is people in this county that has never worked a day in their life, but yet they sit back and draw a check, get food stamps and Oh yea, never have to pay this silly tax because they'll never work. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for helping a person and their family if they deserve it, by this I mean, they are willing to work, if there is a job offered to them. (continued)
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 10, 2007 at 05:30 AM
The next city council meeting will be Tuesday evening at 6:30 p.m. at the City Hall building. Everyone against this tax needs attend. Spread the word, let's make sure the restaurant workers, Cooks & K-Mart employees, gas station attendees, clerks in the gas stations, employees on Main Street, let's make sure EVERYONE knows about this meeting and that they WILL be losing precious money each paycheck to this tax. I'm finding that there are still many that don't realize about how much money they will be losing. People have a right to know! There are many scenarios to why these people may not know, that truly isn't a factor. It's their right as tax payers to know and it's our job, as citizens of Carter County, to educate them if City Council won't. They will probably pass the tax anyways, but we will at least have made a stand and if we continue on our own to research and stand together, I do believe, the tax can be repealed. Please help educate and encourage your "neighbors".
Posted by: Bob on Nov 9, 2007 at 07:56 PM
Well Hank lets prosecute the juvenile that burnt the playground down and make his parents pay for the damage. To my knowledge the Sherriff's Office knows who did this but no charges have been filed as of yet. As far as Ashland goes - they have a bigger city to choose from (if this is actually true)and more to offer. Do you think anyone is going to move to Grayson just to be a police officer here? No retirement and little pay. I think you have a good idea but at this time there is no way that would work. This is not taxation without representation. Boyd County has a tax and several people from Carter County pay it. If these other cities can do it legally-and they do- there is no attorney that can change it. People need to understand that the council said that if they can lower the tax in a few years they will. Let's give this thing a chance. Monday was not a ploy, they have the votes to pass it, maybe they were reaching out to the community hoping they would be meet half way.
Posted by: To Peggy Hill on Nov 9, 2007 at 06:58 PM
I'm not sure why you are boycotting the businesses on Grayson this weekend. I work in Grayson and we have as a group been asking businesses if they are for or against the tax and most businesses are against the tax. Not shopping in Grayson is not going to hurt the city council or the mayor but only the businesses themselves. I think you need to rethink youy boycott...
Posted by: cn on Nov 9, 2007 at 06:03 PM
So many passionate people are involved in this. I love the freedom that has been given to us -- to say what we think and feel. I know both sides have reasons for what we believe. I personally don't want my money stolen from me (and yes stealing, because Lord knows I am not giving it away) and the elected Grayson leaders are desparately trying to find money where they can take it. So, I am praying really hard on this situation. Because,only the Lord knows I don't know if I can make it without the money they are taking. But, regardless of the outcome, whichever side you take, we will always remember 2007 as the year of the payroll tax. Thanks for the memory.
Posted by: steadfast on Nov 9, 2007 at 10:30 AM
i keep hearing grayson compared to other cities such as morehead,ashland,etc.how can you do that?has none of you been to these cities?sure,these cities have payroll tax,but they haven't always had,they didn't have them until they had enough jobs and an income level that would support such a tax!WE HAVE NEITHER!!! why don't the council work on that for awhile first,instead of taking food from a hungry child?does the thought of this bother none of you?have we all grown fat and rich,become coldhearted?have we never had to struggle to make it?PLEASE,in the name of all that is right,DON'T DO THIS
Posted by: Concerned Citizen on Nov 9, 2007 at 10:08 AM
I attended the meeting last Monday night. I realize that a city needs revenue to operate. The only thing I really took away from the meeting was this; Concerned citizens want to work with the city council to come up with alternative ways to bring in this revenue, but that is not going to be an option. Are any of the purchases listed on the council's powerpoint immediately necessary? Couldn't we take a little more time to research some alternatives to this tax? I know many citizens like myself would be more than willing to work with the council on research committees to find a better way to generate the needed revenue.
Posted by: Sheila on Nov 9, 2007 at 08:47 AM
Let's face it, guys!! Grayson will never have anything until the drug problem is resolved. Isn't this the reason for all of the thefts and vandalism in the city? Where were the parents of the kids that burned the playground down? STRUNG OUT!!! So, everybody says the local drug dealers have the police in their pockets. And, the police department wants more money. Right? Then the answer is to develop a program where the cops are offered an incentive for every drug deal that is busted! Both sides win!! The police will do their job, and protect the citizens, while cleaning up our town, and will have more funds coming in. Everybody knows that you can get away with anything if you live in Carter County. I'm ashamed to admit it!! I used to be proud to say that I grew up in Carter County. I would like for my children to be able to say the same thing when they are adults.
Posted by: Hank on Nov 9, 2007 at 06:57 AM
Well Bob, let's get another park the juvenile delinquents can burn down. They appreciated the one the Recreation Alliance built. Until the drugs are cleaned up in this town, we will not be able to have anything. And I know my insurance pays the $500 to the fire dept., but I also know of people that have paid it out of their own pockets, if their insurance didn't. If you work for the city in Ashland, you have to live in the city limits. And what about the office that lives in an entirely diffent county? And lowering the tax Monday night was probably just a ploy, because so many people were there looking them in the face, that doesn't mean they can't raise it again, whenever they want. People need to understand, if they get this money tied up in bonds, then the next mayor and council can't remove it. Doesn't anyone have a friend that is an attorney that could help us? This is TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION!!!!
Posted by: Upset on Nov 8, 2007 at 11:23 PM
As I read all these comments, I want to respond to so many of them. To Mr. Whitehead, you're tired of footing the bill for the people that live outside the city? You should be upset when the city police officers are doing their duty outside "city" limits. How many times are they in the mayors neighborhood or the subdivision's that people believe need to be annexed. And to "monte" that said annexation had to be put on a ballet if 45% of the people did not want it, why should this tax be any different, it should be put on a ballet also. I have sooo many more comments, but I won't go into them at this time. Everyone that opposes the tax or the way the city coucil has handled this situation should show up for the next meeting to show a united front. Even if they pass it, they will know (and see) the opposition and workers that will be taxed can be proud that they did all they could to try and stop it. God Bless America.
Posted by: Bob on Nov 8, 2007 at 10:24 PM
Hank, Your insurance pays the $500.00. What other towns (that have this type of tax) requires the police officer's to live inside that city? If the city does require them to live in the city - is it because of the tax - which city is that?You say that they said they could not raise the tax - what did they do Monday night - they lowered it. As far as nepotism - his son is not getting all of the proceeds from the tax - as you say "now there is a list of things they want to do." A list - maybe do something for the kids in the community. Where is the county park? Maybe a skateboard park for the kids? Maybe make an investment for our future - you know "leave it better thatn you found it!!!" Has anyone thought that, just maybe, the mayor wants to do something good for the city. Maybe he is doing what he thinks is best for the city. Come on people get in the game.
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 8, 2007 at 10:03 PM
Good Question posed by Hank Hill and it leads to another: If they're not required to live in the city limits to work for the City, then why must WE be required to live in the city limits to vote for city matters? I do understand it's the law, as the law stands now.....but it's another thing that angers the people. It seems to be a double standard and frankly, unfair. And to use city equipment off duty or out of the city limits, is probably NOT something you'd find happening in other cities too often, if at all. Most of the police officers that I know elsewhere, have to drive their privately owned vehicles to the station and then "check out" their cruiser and after duty, take their own car, not cruiser, back home. (That at least saves tax dollars as far as gasoline and wear & tear on cruisers.)Good points Hank.
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 8, 2007 at 09:50 PM
City Council seems to have chosen to look at what seems to most of us, only one way of increasing revenue for our town.The easiest way for them (with the exception of us that exercise our democratic right to freedom of speech)and apparently the fastest growing way for the other cities in the state of Kentucky to generate money. Truly, why not be different, set a precedent for others, think outside of the box. We were always told as children, "If your friend jumps off a bridge, would you do it?" That's laughable, but it's not too far from what I'm hearing. "Other cities are doing it." And AGAIN I must inquire, what is the city tax rate? (When was the last time those were raised?)And WHERE IS the money from the Impound Ordinance? And oh yea, by the way, how is the $74,085 (that is the city's distribution amount from its share of the Cigarette tax according to a recent finding on the Kentucky Legistlative site) being used? Check out http://lrc.ky.gov/RECORD/04RS/HB310/LM.doc
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 8, 2007 at 09:45 PM
Why not join resources together with the Tourism Commission and work in harmony for a park, for activities that will benefit not only tourists, but those of us that live here. You could increase your funding that way couldn't you? And give our children a reason to stay here. Right now they're facing not only a lack of things to do as Mr. Steele seems to be concerned about, but also, low wages and now, they're going to face more tax. Why bother? Again, if you're going to pay this tax some could well reason, why not go elsewhere and make more money on the hour, have more opportunity to find jobs other than restaurants or gas stations to work at? There's a big difference between being 18 and 40 . Our children are willing to take a chance and move. Then what happens when our town is left with nothing but the older generation? Our parks & swings will be empty,whatever you have built will go without much business or notice and then our city will be well on its way to being totally dead.
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 8, 2007 at 09:38 PM
I believe that most of us in Carter Co. would like to have more choices of activities to do, such as what other larger cities offer, however, we have lived without these for many years, why do we have to have it all NOW? Mr. Mayor you have 3 more years in office at least,MAYBE more, IF you would think of THE PEOPLE! Why not make these changes as a steady drop in the bucket that will eventually be filled that takes into account the people that you say you are doing it for? Additional avenues for funding need to be more fully researched. Is Grayson a part of the Kentucky League of Cities? I encourage everyone to find this site and read it. It's a resource for the cities of Kentucky to not only learn from, but to obtain assistance from, including financial from what I've read. They suggest that voters know the specifics of the tax and where it's going. Then when the project is complete, the city no longer collect the tax! At the very least you could reduce it upon completion of projects.
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 8, 2007 at 09:18 PM
After doing some research on Occupational Tax around the state, I do understand the revenue that is generated from it. (And wow, what an easy way to generate money for cities!) I do understand that cities need money to run and truly OUR community could certainly benefit from places such as a library, theatre or boys/girls club, provided that they are ran correctly. That is of course, IF, we could even have these type of improvements for our city. One of the major factors of concern with this tax BESIDES that most of us are extremely limited financially, is there has been NO solid direction given by City Council as to where our money is to go. You have not gave US, THE PEOPLE, anything solid to look forward to. And frankly, it needs to be acknowledged as to exactly what our money is going for,not simply the City Council's "wish list" and extremely broad possibilities. Tell us exactly where the money is going. After all it's our money you're spending.
Posted by: Peggy Hill on Nov 8, 2007 at 09:05 PM
Wow. That makes 4 comments I have written that WSAZ won't post. I'm beginning to wonder who is running this site. Mr Steele, is that you? LOL Anyway, I will try ONE MORE TIME to make my comment. I am not going to spend one. red. cent. in Grayson this weekend. I challenge you all to do the same. I have told my co-workers, and we've all called all of our families. We can't show our displeasure by our vote...at least we can do this. I will not name any names (ahem) but a certain fast food restaurant will NEVER AGAIN get any of my business. Spread the word, people. Get on the phone, call your friends and family. They are calling themselves the silent majority; let's show them what a silent majority REALLY is, with our pocketbooks. Thank you Pearl, shame on you Mr Steele & the rest of the council. STOP THE BARNEY FIFE TAX (Somebody needs to make some bumper stickers!)
Posted by: Bob (con't) on Nov 8, 2007 at 07:58 PM
And to mention Sam Perry as being behind this is just unbelievable. Mr. Perry has done more for this community in the last 20 plus years than most of us put together. He is a good man who sees that this town needs help. Bob Genung is another person who deserves to be commended. He to is a good man who has be a good for this community - just as George Steele has been good for this community. History will tell us that this tax will be benefit our town. Maybe the county could be good stewards of our money and get us a library. The county gov't should remember the old saying "Those that live in glass house should not throw rocks." With all that I have said - the tax will pass. Just give it a chance and give those who are elected a chance to show you that this will work.
Posted by: Bob (con't) on Nov 8, 2007 at 07:44 PM
As far as not spending money in your hometown - that does not solve a problem. The council is not going to change their minds. This tax is going to happen. The powerpoint by Fraley the other night was to the point. Look at other cities. They have a similiar tax and the have money to match grants that they receive. Grayson can't match the grants that they receive. Their police force has no retirement. The fire department needs better equipment - and maybe a few full-time employees. As far as the person saying that Grayson should have a volunteer polce department - you have got to be joking. Name me just one town the size of Grayson that has a volunteer police dept. You can't - unless their is a sheriff's department answering the calls. It is time for Grayson to move forward and this tax will help Grayson go forward. Stop making personal, thoughtless and incorrect attacks on the council and mayor - give them a chance to. They are doing the best the can with what they have.
Posted by: Bob on Nov 8, 2007 at 07:35 PM
Just a few thoughts that I would like to share. 1st - Councilmen Fraley is not a teachers aide. If you are going to say something try to make sure you have your facts straight. 2nd - It seems that there is alot of teachers that are opposed to this measure. If I have my facts straight, and I believe I do, teachers' salaries are paid with revenues from taxes. Let's do away with some of the taxes that pay their salary. 3rd - The Steeles have not, nor do they control the school board. Mr. & Mrs. Steele, to the best of my knowledge, have never served on the school board. They have both worked for the school system for several years and both have been principals. 4th - As far as the lady that mentioned annexation - you say that Mr. Steele does not want this because he then would have to pay the tax. Have you been drinking? Maybe everybody needs to take a step back and think about this before they speak. Why not give this tax a chance? Con't
Posted by: ashamed of grayson on Nov 8, 2007 at 06:19 PM
I agree with cn.. I will no longer buy anything at Ralph's, Slones, Ruperts, Horton & Brown, Farmers Hardware, Kmart, or do any banking in Grayson. I will no longer buy my gas or eat at any of the restaurants in Grayson. I think a lot of the problem is mismangement. there are a lot of ways to cut expenses in the city. For one, quit letting the police drive the city vehicles home and on the personal time and don't pay their family plan insurance. I don't of anyone that doesn't pay for their family to be added to their health insurance policy. I only work to get health insurance for my family and my check is less than $100.00 every 2 weeks. So the city wants to take part of that now. The only one on the council that has a heart is Pearl Crum!!! And the rest of them didn't even want to answer any questions at the meeting Monday night.
Posted by: Peggy Hill on Nov 8, 2007 at 06:02 PM
Count me in. If the merchants don't want to speak out they will no longer receive my business, nor any of my family's. Particularly McDonald's. Never again, not just this weekend, either. I am shocked that Mr Perry is for this tax, truly and honestly shocked. (I did not know this until reading these comments.) Could not attend last Tuesday because I had a prior commitment but will definitely be there next week, not that it will do any good but still. I'm saddened that WSAZ withholds so many of these posts, too. I have posted 3 now that didn't "make the cut". Will close this comment as I've closed all of mine: Thank you Pearl! And shame on you Mr Steele and the rest of the council. STOP THE BARNEY FIFE TAX! (We need bumper stickers printed up with this slogan!)
Posted by: TA on Nov 8, 2007 at 05:37 PM
Grayson residents, show up Tuesday night at the Council meeting and be heard! Mayor Steele and Council members, with the exception of Pearl Crum, are imposing a tax that only one of them will pay on their primary income. Needs are understood, but other options need to be explored. Accept help from an unbiased selection of citizens committee to explore alternatives if possible before imposing this tax. Council members don't be so closed minded. A "Users Tax" was not mentioned at the meeting. Comparing us to Ashland or Boyd Co. is not right. We don't have the industry, income, or population that those communities generate. We want to see our city grow, but not at the cost of its families. Thanks Pearl for standing up to "Goliath". I applaud you. "You" are the smart one who truly cares about Grayson and its residents. Council members give this city a chance to work together and not divide.
Posted by: BJ on Nov 8, 2007 at 05:04 PM
People of Grayson, wake up and pay attention! We do not want to lose our town. The newspaper quoted Mr. Steele as saying, "we tried annexation". This is simply just not true. I live in a sub-division and have asked many other people in these sub-divisions if they had been asked to annex and no one had asked them. The paper also quoted Mayor Steele about no matching funds to receive grants. Well anyone who has knowledge of matching grant funds knows that labor, services, facilities and many other things can count as matching funds. Olive Hill has received many grants and they did not have to have $ to match to receive them. I have never witnessed something as unfair as this tax and have never seen people so unwilling to be reasonable to look at alternatives. I am very willing to be annexed into the city. At least this way we could have a voice to help overturn this Dictatorship. We have better and smarter people in this city than this. There are better ways to solve problems.
Posted by: The Truth on Nov 8, 2007 at 04:24 PM
The one comment that really bothered me about the whole meeting was made by Mr. Fraley. One lady, a bus driver, asked him if he could live on her salary and he stated he went to college so he wouldn't have to live on that salary. Maybe the police officers of Grayson should have listened to Mr. Fraley's advice and went to college if that is the easy answer. Beleive it or not Brandon all people do not have that opportuntiy. I was a lucky one that did, and so were you. Officer Steele had the opportunity as well, but has always been a bit "disorderly" if you will. The state trooper academy was an option, but certain prescriptions will keep you out of there as well. Luckily Mr. Steele could hire a certain city council members niece when he was principal, and one back scratching definitely deserves another, and so Officer Steele was hired. I have a couple of questions. Are all officers going to get matching retirement, or just the select few? Also is the Mayor's job going fulltime?
Posted by: Laney on Nov 8, 2007 at 04:12 PM
I would like to say this to those against the tax. When there are no street lights on at night in Grayson, dont complain. When the traffic lights are off and traffic jams occur, dont complain. When the ambulance can not get a loved one who is dieing because the streets are not drivable, dont complain. When your house is on fire and no one responds, dont complain. When you are being beaten by your husband and no police respond, dont complain. I have paid school taxes for years without having any children in school. I pay taxes to the ambulance, extension and health district without ever using their services. I dont mind paying this tax because I like many others use the city streets and traffic lights. I pray that I never have to use the fire dept. or police dept. services. You wont know how bad you will miss these services until you dont have them anymore.(especially in a time of need)
Posted by: c on Nov 8, 2007 at 02:59 PM
I say, put it to a vote to Grayson Residents. In my heart I really don't believe that all the businesses in this town are all for it. Even if people are for something like this and keep raising the employees income, it would not help because the more you earn the more they take. So, put it to a city vote. I beg the city leaders just to stop and not move so fast. It seems that you are just jumping into this. Family Insurance plans for your policemen? Is that necessary? I don't have that where I work, I have to pay for my children's medical coverage. Did you not check about the options? What about checking to see how many people are working and recieving welfare in this county? I bet a lot of people would be surpised. There are other options, I beg of you, please stop and think. Before children have to do without bread and milk for somebody's selfish wants of a city park and new building.
Posted by: Gail on Nov 8, 2007 at 01:38 PM
"Anon." scroll down and you will see, again, that Mr. Fraley is NOT an aide with the school system. He has never worked for the school system. I find it simply appalling that the people of Grayson and Carter county cannot hold conversations or meetings without making personal attacks their main point. Do your research on the issues at hand folks, not on ways to futher damage reputations of other citizens who are trying to better the community. Carter county and Grayson are way behind the times and need to catch up if they are to survive. I have lived in other cities all across the state and we have always paid payroll taxes for the town in which we worked and that was not always where we lived. I paid 3 years worth of payroll tax to the city of Cincinnati and have never lived there. I was poor then too and it didn't kill me. Congrats to Mr. Fraley and the rest of the council for having the vision to make the city a better place for all of us. Even the ones who don't want it.
Posted by: admirer on Nov 8, 2007 at 01:35 PM
I don't want a very special person to go un-noticed in the mess that has come from the proposed payroll tax,and no matter what the outcome,my hat is off to Pearl Crum!Standing alone for what she actually believes to be right.Way to go girl!!
Posted by: Hank Hill on Nov 8, 2007 at 10:28 AM
Why are city policemen and city employees not required to live in the city limits of Grayson, such as they are in other towns that have this payroll tax? Why should the city foot the bill for them to use city gas & city owned vehicles to work out at Fitness Trainers every night? Why do we have a police officer that lives in Elliott County and drives his cruiser home every night? The Attorney General should investigate the nepotism. And for Mr. Roger Whitehead, (which is Brandon Fraleys' uncle), who stood up at the meeting on Monday night and said he was tired of footing all the bill for the people that live outside the city. Are you not aware that if my house catches fire and I call the fire dept., then I receive a bill for their services for at least $500.00? When this all started, this tax was for the police dept, now there is a list of things they want to do. Ms. Nash said they could not raise the tax in this ordinance. But, all they have to do is make an amendment and they wil
Posted by: STEADFAST on Nov 8, 2007 at 09:20 AM
TELL EVERYONE YOU CAN!! non-resident grayson employees-the grayson merchants have done NOTHING to help us yet,we need their voice,but we need to send them a message-DON'T SPEND ANY MONEY IN GRAYSON ON FRIDAY,SATURDAY,OR SUNDAY!! you can do it,without their help we're doomed!!AND ATTEND TUESDAY'S MEETING(BUT PLEASE BE PEACEFUL-ANGER GET'S US NOWHERE!)
Posted by: cn on Nov 8, 2007 at 07:29 AM
I myself am very disappointed in the whole situation. You have a panel of people who stand to lose nothing and hundreds of people who will stand to loose so much. People in the community need milk, diapers and they are living paycheck to paycheck. as for me, if the payroll tax comes through, no more anything in Grayson. I will pull everything I have and place it in other places such as Ashland. Wal-Mart here I come! I also believe that it is very discrimatory of the City Council to sit there and say you pay for this, and we don't have to. What year is this anyways? I was there at the meeting and all I heard was our fire dept goes out in the county and help. Well, doesn't other departments respond to Grayson when they need help? Is these departments going to benefit from any of this? Theives usually keep the loot. Thou Shalt Not Steal...
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 8, 2007 at 07:15 AM
It truly does seem that we are headed toward our own "communist" regime here in Grayson. How sad. However, I am hoping that everyone expressing an opinion against the tax will urge others to join together at the next city council meeting coming up next week. It is my understanding this meeting will take place at the City Bldg. (naturally we all can't fit in there if as many or more show up than at the last meeting)BUT we can at least make it known once again, TOGETHER, that many of us are against this tax.Wouldn't it be something to have the city building surrounded with good, honest, hard working people that won't lie down to take what the "good ol' boys" want to dish out to us? It may be our last stand, yet, it should speak volumes to those around us. I know that Mayor Steele and most of his council won't care, but, it will be for us THE PEOPLE, that it will matter too. The last meeting was just for show by him letting us be there and speak...this one will be for US!
Posted by: Don Utley on Nov 8, 2007 at 02:31 AM
Where was the public outcry when the last Mayor we had sat on her hands and did absolutely NOTHING to better the city? Everyone wants a piece of cake, no one want to purchase an oven to bake it in! Ot am!
Posted by: Monte on Nov 7, 2007 at 09:02 PM
Loretta, I am afraid you are totally incorrect when you stated that there are more employees at the city building than in the past. There are the same number of workers in the building as there was before Mr. Steele took office. Also there are no such grants available for wages. I have written several grants in the past 10 years and know for certain that is not an option. Everyone seems to know more about possible revenues for the City, I suggest you do your homework, compile the necessary data and present it in a completed format to the Mayor and Council. It is easier to sit back and complain than to help solve the problem. I will offer my assistance. And to Christine's comment on annexation. You need to realize that annexation of a residential area requires being put on the ballet if 45% of the residents do not want the annexation. Please people do your homework before making accusations.
Posted by: $$$ on Nov 7, 2007 at 07:48 PM
We have firefighters than volunteer their time and lives to help us. The cops are already getting paid, and it isnt enough? I am glad that the Volunteer Fire Department has men and women that are willing to help out without big bucks. Thanks to all the brave firefighters!! Maybe you guys should demand money and payment from the city. Get in on the money racket and take some of the tax money too. Fair is fair!
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 7, 2007 at 07:07 PM
So Mr. Fraley is an aide with the school system; no big shocker there seeing as the Steele's have practically controlled the school board for several years now. and now that Mr. Steele is now in the Mayor's office, it would appear that his pathetic political favors and connections have branched out right along with him, seeing as his son is on the police department and his longtime family friend is on the city council here in town. Is it just me, or didn't Ernie Fletcher just get raked over the coals for the same load of favoritism crap? Sorry to burst your bubble, "poor", "oppressed" and "depressed" but with the Steele's in the Mayor's office you're about to see just how the old communist regeims worked down through the years.
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 7, 2007 at 06:36 PM
If you ask me the payroll tax is as big a joke as the city council itself. Of course they're wanting more money for the police department; after all, the mayor's son is a an active member of that particular department. And who says small towns can't play politics.
Posted by: christine on Nov 7, 2007 at 06:28 PM
Is Nepotism still alive or what? George Steele has one thing on his mind and that is to try to better his son's life. Have you heard of conflict of interest? Or is that for the real workers in the community? George Steele needs to step down from this matter as it seems he is setting himself up for a lawsuit. I stand to loose a significant amt of money from this, with raising 2 young children I cannot afford this. It could possibly break us. Is it really worth slaughtering several families to help a few out? Why does all the funding have to come at once? Why not raise property taxes and do the projects in stages starting with what is most important, the personnel. I know that the leaders of the community are going to push the law to the fullest extent. But, to me it is still nothing political stealing. Annexation is the way to go, but Mayor Steele does not want this as he himself would have to pay the taxes! Shame on YOU!!
Posted by: Anon on Nov 7, 2007 at 05:19 PM
It seems a shame that the Grayson City Council is able to attack the livelihood of a group of people who have NO ability to vote against the Council members. They have taken an easy way out to enable themselves to push forward their own agendas to benefit either themselves or their families. We, people living outside of the city, will gain no benefits. We will only loose money and freedom. We have absolutely no direct say in this matter according to Mayor Steele, and this will be ramrodded through dispite what any of us say.
Posted by: Upset on Nov 7, 2007 at 04:58 PM
Those of saying that we should, "work together", need to realize that there is no working together. The tax is going to happen. The mayor needs to take care of his son. It's a done deal. The meetings are just a formality. In the end, Grayson is still going to be nothing more than a "Truck Stop".
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 7, 2007 at 04:52 PM
go ahead and tax me I don't care, however I have always tried to buy everything I needed in Grayson well that is going to change walmart here I come. The payroll tax will be the only dime Grayson gets from me,
Posted by: Carter County Employee on Nov 7, 2007 at 02:36 PM
After reading some of the comments posted I am apalled that we are being represented as heartless and uncaring. I would have to say I'm not opposed to the tax, but am interested in the specifics of how it will be used. I attended the meeting for questions to be answered, none were. I also would love for our police, fire, emt's and etc. to have a raise and to have the equipment they need. I also want for us all to work together and respect one another's view's. The future our our community deserves this. Yes, the tax will take away from my own children. I think we all should share the load and not just a particular group. And, yes the council should answer questions that are presented to them. Silence is a sign of guilt or something to hide. I think we all just want some specifics, not silence and nodding heads. WORK TOGETHER GRAYSON! OUR COMMUNITY DESERVES IT !!
Posted by: Mike Roberts on Nov 7, 2007 at 01:14 PM
I would like to offer my support and congratulations to Brandon Fraley and to the other City officials of Grayson for trying to make a difference in their community. It is very encouraging to me to see that Grayson has leadership that is actually looking out for the betterment of the community. You finally have people in place in your government offices that want and are willing to make changes to try and better the entire community. As most of you I have seen very little positive changes in the economical growth of the community in several decades. In order to attract new economical growth to your community it is going to take progressive leadership and foresight and by the way it sounds you have that.
Posted by: Resident on Nov 7, 2007 at 01:05 PM
Mr. Tired of carrying the burdon: Who do you mean self-righteous? Freeloaders? Are you talking about our educators? The people who took the time to further their education, who deal with more non-sense in one day than you do in a year. They are payed far less than the amount of time that the put into the education of our children. Let me slow my typing down so that you can understand me, my wife and I are both college graduates, she is an educator, and I work out of the city. Luckily for us I am the primary "bread winner." (that means I make more money in case you didn't understand the slang) The proposed tax will only affect her salary not mine. It will affect many people where both spouses work within the city. Now, will the money be used correctly? Probably not. Will it go to improve the overall quality of life for the residents? Nope. I don't need the city to find ways to waste my money, and yes they will waste it. Your only burden is squarely on top of your shoulders.
Posted by: Pearl on Nov 7, 2007 at 12:42 PM
Is there a way to collect information on how much actual money can be collected by doing figures on what 1/2 % would be, also 3/4 % before the last ordinance is read. We all need to work together for the City of Grayson. I have heard people saying they are going to quit shopping in the City of Grayson. Please stop and think, 2 wrongs do not make a right. The Lord that we serve says Do unto others as you would have them to do unto you. We all need to say a Special Prayer and ask God to direct us on what the correct decison is. The merchants of Grayson have had no input on this except maybe 2 people, do not hurt the merchants of Grayson. They employee people and they need every dime they can get as they two will be paying part of the Tax.
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 7, 2007 at 11:56 AM
I just want to thank the mayor for taking away my ability to provide birthday and christmas presents for my child. I hope you are able to sleep at night. You break it down that it is only so much a week, but it adds up over a years time. It was money that I set aside for my child. When my child asks why she doesn't have anything, I will have her knock on the mayor's door, to ask him.
Posted by: POOR on Nov 7, 2007 at 10:12 AM
I LIVE IN THE CITY, I ALREADY PAY CITY TAXES, I DON'T FEEL THAT I NEED TO PAY A PAYROLL TAX AND TAKE MORE MONEY FROM MY POCKET AND GIVE IT TO SOMEONE THAT MAKES MORE MONEY THAN I DO, LET ALL THEM PAY THE TAX AND PUT II IN MY WALLET!!! EVERYONE WANTS A RAISE, BUT YOU CHHOSE YOUR OWN PROFESSION, IF YOU ARE NOT HAPPY WITH THE MONEY YOU MAKE FIND ANOTHER JOB, DON'T TAKE IT FROM SOMEONE ELSE.I REALLY FEEL SORRY FOR THE MIN. WAGE WORKERS WHO DO THE BEST THEY CAN TO SUPPORT THEIR FAMILIES THE WAY IT IS, BUT THATS OK, GO AHEAD AND TAKE SOME MORE FOOD OFF THEIR TABLES!
Posted by: Oppressed on Nov 7, 2007 at 08:02 AM
What happened with the Impound Ordinance that was supposed to bring in additional monies for the police officers? How is that Ordinance playing out? Why is the city property tax rate at only .18/$100 for the city? Are these not options for additional revenue? Could a restaurant tax going to tourism not find a way to be used for the city parks or street renovations since tourists would use those? Why is it that low income people that have sliding fee scales at doctor's offices or qualify for government funding, i.e. food stamps, heat, etc., not be able to have an exemption from this tax based on their wages? Let the people that make more, pay more, not the mother/father pulling 2 jobs to take care of their families. Why shouldn't we go to another county to work, where we may pay the tax there, but make more on the hour than here in Grayson? Why is it that the Council refuses to address the issues on property tax and where the heck is the money from the Impound Ordinance at today?
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 7, 2007 at 07:52 AM
I have known the Steele's for years, went to school with their son, Ada was one of my teachers, and was even at the middle school when george was a principle. They have their troubles just as every other family. They are good people and have always tried their best to make the right decisions. But I feel they havent looked at all other alternatives yet, i am positive he will make the best decision he can, even if it doesnt appear to be at first. I oppose the tax though just like everyone else i know i am budgeted to the penny and worked tons of side jobs to make it. I feel people get off the subject though when they start complaining about the payroll of the council and the mayor, they have worked hard to succeed and if they can better themselves with these jobs, good. Running a city is a hard stressful job and i wouldnt want that pressure. Hopefully this can be resolved and be fair to everyone.
Posted by: renee' on Nov 7, 2007 at 07:05 AM
hey guys, I understand that this may put a strain on some people. I work in Grayson and live outside of town like most of the people who are upset. But really do we need all these personal attacks? Grayson does need to be a better place, so lets start by showing how we all should be. I understand the frustrations * I do * but this is not a forum for attacking someone personally. Yes this is a tax. Let's deal with the tax situation. NOT ATTACKING EACH OTHER! Please....I am praying for all who are involved.
Posted by: Loretta on Nov 7, 2007 at 06:31 AM
I don't think the payroll tax is fair to all the people that are making just minimum wage. I just have enough money from my paycheck to pay my bills and to suppport my family. I know that there are grants out there and other sources to help give the city workers a raise. I know that I would love to have better benefits at work to. They should be thankful that they have a job to come to everyday. I know that they didn't used to have as many people working in the city building that they have now. This tax will make it alot harder on the people that has to work that just live pay day to pay day and dont even have enough to pay their bills. I know of several waitresses they just work for 2.15 a hour plus what little tips they get. How is students going to be able to work so they can help pay for their tutition and get their things they need? I also hear that the city employees and several different employees in the city will be exempt from paying this tax. which isnt fair. God Bless us all!
Posted by: depressed on Nov 7, 2007 at 01:11 AM
I did not get mad at that meeting, but very depressed. If the city would have done this when they needed to all the bitterness would have already been long gone. I use their roads everyday. I grew up in this city. And even though there is more fast food, how long has the city pool been closed. I was there everyday as a kid. Now they are playing in the streets not caring about themselves or others property. Is Grayson going forward or backwards, I mean before this tax. If some of you would have listened in that meeting Mr. Fraley's powerpoint was educational. Maybe if you would have listen, instead of being mad you would have heard.
Posted by: Upset on Nov 6, 2007 at 11:30 PM
There's no silent majority, and it’s not hard to stand up when there’s no consequences to your actions. The fact is, the majority of the people who will have to pay the tax, and oppose it, couldn't vote in the city council race. City council and the mayor don't have to worry about losing re-election; therefore they can "go forth and conquer". The tax is going to pass the tax no matter how many people oppose it. Councilman Suttles is Assistant Fire Chief. Grayson PD employs the mayor’s son. Care to guess who will benefit most from this new tax? I just wish they'd get this over with, so that the mayor’s son could have his raise, and the city council could get back to the business of bringing more fast food, and gas stations to Grayson.
Posted by: Concerned Grayson Worker on Nov 6, 2007 at 11:26 PM
I live outside the city and county, but Grayson is a great city and community. I'm proud to say I work here. The company I work for employs about 130 people and the estimated tax will be approximately $50,000 annually for the employees combined. The tax from me and my co-workers alone would support at least one and 1/2 police officers for the city. If the tax actually goes for this benefit then it would be a benefit, however, with the city's history I am sceptical. Let us all hope the tax money goes for the reasons stated.
Posted by: Ada Steele on Nov 6, 2007 at 10:52 PM
For Kay (continued): Brandon Fraley is not an aide with the school system. He is a family friend. He is also an outstanding young man with a great education, strong character, and excellent leadership skills. Brandon was elected president of the student government at Morehead State University. He was recently appointed to the Grayson city council, but today he was elected by the voters to the position. He is an active member of First Baptist Church. He has a wonderful wife and two beautiful children. He is a young man of whom this community and school system should be proud. Rhea Evans is the daughter of my cousin. She also graduated from MSU last spring with a major in government. She was named "Outstanding Government Student" at MSU last year. She is continuing her education at MSU, pursuing a master's degree. With her qualifications, it is no wonder that when a part-time position opened at the city building early this year, Rhea was hired.
Posted by: Ada Steele on Nov 6, 2007 at 10:38 PM
This is for Kay: I have been employed for the past 33.5 years by the Carter County Board of Education. I taught the children of Grayson for many years. Most are adults now. While I have enjoyed that time with the children, I will be retiring at the end of the year. I can assure you I have no intentions of going to work for the city. If I wanted to continue working, I would continue to do so within the school system where I have the education, training, and experience needed to do the job.
Posted by: Carter Co. Teacher on Nov 6, 2007 at 10:19 PM
I truly am sorry if we appeared to be narrow minded at the open meeting held to allow for the free expression of ideas and view points. I hold the greatest respect for the hard working protectors of our community and really resent the fact that this issue has created such a divide. The issue is not over fair pay for our fellow servants in the community. I wouldn't mind a reasonable tax to support better wages and benefits for those who protect and serve. I do pay my fair share of taxes. And as a law abiding citizen of this great nation, I will continue to do so. But I will not be silenced nor will I ever teach the children of this community that when they disagree with the actions taken by their government that they should simply keep their mouth shut and take it. Do you really want this? I will be professional and will not discuss this issue in my classroom. But I will continue to teach my children about how our founding fathers stood against tyranny because KY requires it.
Posted by: Dang proud on Nov 6, 2007 at 10:10 PM
I guess the silent majority has spoken. Congratulations to Mr Fraley for overcoming last nights rude warnings and threats from the crowd to get you kicked out of office for supporting the payroll tax. I am a dang proud citizen in Landsdowne Estates. I only wish I could have voted for you too.
Posted by: Ralph on Nov 6, 2007 at 07:09 PM
I attended last night's meeting. I heared County Judge Executive Charles Wallace offered to help the City of Grayson at last night's meeting. Then Mr. Steele asked Mr. Wallace to do away with the $40,000 a year dispatching fees the City of Grayson pays the County. Mr. Wallace never responded. Why not Judge Wallace? Why are cities paying the Carter County Fiscal court for dispatching services when all tax payers are paying E-911 taxes on all of our utility bills? With a 6.1 million dollar County budget, I dont think you would miss a mere $40,000. I pay both city and county taxes, as many people do, and I would like to see the Judge help out the Cities of Olive Hill and Grayson by doing away with the dispatching fees.
Posted by: tired of carrying the burden on Nov 6, 2007 at 06:02 PM
I was appalled last night that so many people that make a living off our taxes could be so opposed to paying taxes to provide a decent living to those who serve us, and to provide equipment and facilities for our safety. It also concerns me that these narrow minded individuals are with our children everyday, molding their developing minds. If so much "educated" research was put into suggesting alternatives to this tax, why were alternatives presented that are not permitted by law to be used, such as the restaurant tax? Yes it would be fairer, but state law is plain it must go solely to tourism. You say you wont benefit? Remember the potential school violence or the fire that puts you out of work due to a lack of available, trained first responders. Be the professional you are educated to be. Pay your share as I am tired of carrying the burden for the self-righteous freeloaders.
Posted by: Former council member on Nov 6, 2007 at 05:45 PM
I work in the city and I live in the city, and I must say that this council has more nerve than I had when I served in recent years. Revenue has been a serious issue in Grayson for several years, especially following the 1980's when revenue sharing was cut out by the federal government as a handout to local governments. This put a real strain on both cities and counties. This necessitated the enactment of new taxes such as the ambulance tax, increase in the insurance tax, the E-911 tax and additional school taxes(all by the county). I know first hand the city has tightened its belt every year and eventually you get to the point that you can't tighten any more. Public safety must come first. I actually left the council due to pressure from the public that does not understand the difficult decisions that must be made. Councils options are limited. The city can't tax cigarettes, gasoline or add tax to utilities. They are taking the only option they have.
Posted by: Maw Bell on Nov 6, 2007 at 05:41 PM
Ms Kay, I am afraid you have been misinformed. Mr. Fraley is not a aide at the school. He was not at fault for the sound system at the meeting last night. I was there too. I do not believe Mrs. Steele will not be working at the city as of 1/1/08 due to the nepotism law. Mr. Steele did not go out and hire people, he filled a open position. And as for Mr. Perry, you should have attended the meeting in September. I did. Mr. Perry was behind this tax 100%. He encouraged the Mayor and Council. He even stated that he would give his employees a raise to make up the difference. I too will have to pay this tax. As a single mother, I know how hard it can be, but I have always trusted in the Lord to get me through.
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 6, 2007 at 02:52 PM
I AM A SNGLE MOM WITH 3 CHILDREN, I WORK 2 MIM. WAGE JOBS IN GRAYSON. I HAVE TO LOOK AT MY CHILDREN ON A DAILY BASES AND TELL THEM NO YOU CANNOT HAVE THAT OR NO WE CANNOT AFFORD THAT. THIS TAX WILL EFFECT MY FAMILY, WE BUDGET EVERY PENNY WE GET. THIS PAYROLL TAX WILL AFFECT MY FAMILY AND MANY OTHERS. IT MAY NOT SEEM LIKE MUCH TO YOU BUT TO ME AND MY CHILDREN IT IS ALOT. I WANT TO ASK THE COUNCIL MEMBERS HOW MANY TIMES DO YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT YOUR CHILDREN AND SAY NO BECAUSE YOU DO NOT HAVE IT TO GIVE.
Posted by: Grayson on Nov 6, 2007 at 02:33 PM
There are other things that can be done and we won't need a payroll tax. Write tickets for speeding or make the county wet that would pull in new businesses. Get a commission that knows what best for the county and people. Maybe we need to start caring about the middle class because we are the ones who end up paying for it in the end. Before you people support something that only hurts the little people, look into others things that could be done to improve this community.
Posted by: Jim on Nov 6, 2007 at 02:29 PM
I don't think anyone present at the meeting last night is opposed to making our town a better place. City workers including the police deserve and need the pay raise promised by the council. I currently work two jobs in order to support my family and that sometimes is not enough. Now what do I do? Will the Mayor with his large, untaxed retirement or appointed (mayor's friend) councilman Fraley with his $100K plus salary, which will not be taxed by this proposal help me pay my bills? Let's build a wonderful park for our children. I would love for the fire department to have a brand new state of the art facility to keep their trucks in. But if we can't afford these things at this time, why take from those who have no say? Surely we can work together to find another solution to our wants while we meet our needs. In the prayer offered at the beginning of the meeting, it was asked of God to give a portion of his wisdom to the decisions made. It seemed that this was asked in vain.
Posted by: kay on Nov 6, 2007 at 01:35 PM
i feel that Mr.Fraley should had talk up so the peiole could hear him,he is a aide at east carter,if he has the education that he said he is paying for why he working at a aide for carter co schools? George steele has to have this money so his son,granddaughter and wife can look good. Did yo know that Ada Steele will alsobe working for the city come 1/1/08 if the taxes pass she will be over the taxes. I feel you have already make up your mind , you don't care who get hurt cause of the tax,you retire then took a job away from someone just out of college so you could draw two checks each month.Mr.Steele you said you will only have to paid $ 8.00 out of your paid on this why don;t you give one of your checks for it . Why did you hire all the extra help just a quick that you took office you hired Rhea Evans which is family and still in school,Mr Fraley is also a friend of the family.If you put the tax on the working people we all should go to olive Hill to shop.Sam Perry is behind this.
Posted by: Sherry on Nov 6, 2007 at 12:51 PM
If you want to tax the town, that's fine, but I can't see it going to the police department who are never in town, and when they are who do they have pulled over some little 16 yr old girl. Maybe we should look into a new police departmemt, that will work in the city limits and stop all the speeding on Carol Malone. Maybe you and the city council should think about making the city moist or wet, we are right on the interstate which would make a great location for a big mall and restaurant other than fast food. This would not hurt the town but help it, stop and think, how many people in town drive to Ashland or to Huntington to eat. What about the people that are just making from pay day to pay day, because of gas prices, groceries and doctor bills. What about the people that have never worked, get a check food stamps and everything else, are you going to tax them, does that seem fair!
Posted by: Brenda on Nov 6, 2007 at 08:35 AM
I would like to commend Mayor Steele and the Grayson City Council for trying to improve the living standard for the people in Grayson and Carter County. I am one of those people that live outside the city limits but work in the city, although none of us like to pay taxes everyone knows that taxes are necessary in the world we live in today. At least with the payroll tax the people of Grayson and Carter County will be able to see some of the benefits of the tax unlike many of our State and Federal taxes of which a large portion are spent on people who will not work (INSIDE or OUTSIDE the city). As Mayor Steele stated, this not a new concept many of our surrounding cities already have this tax in place. I worked in Huntington, WV for 13 years and although what I paid was not a payroll tax but a "User Fee" it was still money deducted from my paycheck that went to the city of Huntington to maintain the city streets that I drove on inorder to arrive at my place of employment.
Posted by: Against the tax on Nov 6, 2007 at 08:28 AM
I believe that if the city managed their funds better, they wouldn't need the tax. I'm for the police getting a raise and better retirement, I would like a raise myself, but this isn't the way. This is causing a lot of hard feelings in this town. Of course, the ones voting to put this raise on won't have to worry about the next election. By choosing to put on a payroll tax instead of raising city taxes, they are working on securing their votes for next time. I'm tired of hearing "It's nothing new, lots of cities are doing it". I don't care about other cities, I care about MY paycheck and what it takes from my family!
Posted by: Anonymous on Nov 6, 2007 at 07:25 AM
I just hope the council listens to the people.
Posted by: Meeting Attender on Nov 6, 2007 at 06:42 AM
Dear Council, I want to personally thank you from the bottom of my heart for trying to better this town. I wish I lived in the city so I could vote for each and every one of you (except Pearl Crum!). I applaud you for having the courage to stand up for what you believe in. If anyone doesn't agree, then maybe they should move within city limits and run for council. You all are doing all you can with the lousy resources you can, and I commend you for it. Thank you for trying to make this a town that is safe for my child to grow up in. Thank you for putting your neck out there and doing what's best for the CITY!!!! My prayers are with you all, and may you not crack and fall under pressure like one of you has already done. Stand up for what's right! You know you can!
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